How wonky is Sébastien Haller

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terrya1965
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by terrya1965 » Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:53 pm

Whiskyman wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:05 pm
Dwayne Pipes wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:03 pm


Probably swayed by the thousands of fucking fans chanting to sign the cunt up.
I completely agree with that. Probably the same thousands of fans who also saw Joe Hart as a top quality signing. :lol: :lol:
Personally,I couldn't understand it,but we all know why he signed.Sullivan thought the England GK would put us on the map.We had a keeper just has good as him at the club.
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Parry Hotter
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by Parry Hotter » Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:40 pm

Whiskyman wrote:
Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:15 am
Neville Bartos wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:21 pm
Haller is not a target man, he's not a lone forward, he's not Andy Carroll 2.0.
The mistake we've made here, the mistake we make over and over, is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole.
If we want more from Haller we play him in a two, or even better a three like at Frankfurt.
It's easy to get annoyed with players, but fuck me if the problems at our club don't run a lot deeper.

We've all heard the story Jack Charlton tells about Alf Ramsey telling him that he was picked not because he was the best CB, but because he was the best fit for Ramsey's system.
We don't do this. Too often we compromise and just buy a good player for the sake of buying a good player. And that's Haller.

If we'd bought him and dropped him into an identical, or at least similar, system to that at Frankfurt? That would've been clever, good business, why? Because you're giving a £40m investment the best possible chance to succeed.
What we did was fail to land Gomez. Compromise on Haller. And try to make him play in a system more suited to Gomez.
Of course the good news is that Haller has gone from trying to impersonate Gomez to trying to impersonate Duncan Ferguson. I'm sure it will go very well.
All very true, but we don't have players anything like the calibre of Jovic and Rebic to play as a front 3 with him.

But you're right about square pegs and round holes. It was fairly common knowledge we were after Maxi Gomez, who is a completely different type of player to Haller. Having signed Haller we have attempted to adapt him to the system rather than tinkering with the system to accommodate him.

Which is fucking stupid. You scout a player, you see what he can and can't do. Decide he's good at what he does and then bring him in and ask him to change his game. The same criticism has been levelled at England managers in the past. Making the mistake of selecting the best players and trying to get them to function as a team. Instead of picking the best team to play the system you want to play.

There's a player in the Bundesliga who would have been an ideal striker for us. I mentioned the bloke on here about 4 years ago when he was at Hoffenheim . He ended up at Bayer Leverkusen and is still a cracking player but now well out of our price range.

If some cunt like me can identify a player who'd be a good fit surely it shouldn't be beyond the ability of someone earning his living by studying footballers. It's Kevin Volland btw.
goodpost:)

Nailed it whiskey. England had it with Lampard and Gerard who cant play together so why pick both just because there the best midfielders. Pick a team not the best players. Same with signings.
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jameskel
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by jameskel » Fri Feb 14, 2020 12:20 pm

Best attribute is his heading ?

we have 2 wide men, who both cut in on to their preferred foot and don't cross the fucking ball

So, unless we are going to use him at the back, defending corners, might as well sell him for glue.

It s a classic FM 2019 buy, courtesy of Sullivan junior
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Chicken Runner
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by Chicken Runner » Fri Feb 14, 2020 3:03 pm

Yes hes good at holding up play, strong etc, he has very slow feet. He seems clumsy and slow to move the ball from under his feet. Doesnt get invovled enough in the play and therefore has very little impact on the game.
Thumbs down for me. Sorry Charlie mate :lol:
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terrya1965
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by terrya1965 » Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:29 pm

Shouldn't the O be an A in Wonky? ;)
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BCHammer
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by BCHammer » Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:18 am

He is a good player.

But we dont have a vision, plan or anything. This stinks of someone in a boardroom securing the best striker in Europe available who is willing to come to West Ham, without anyone checking why he was successful at Frankfurt and what else we need here for him to be equally successful.

Teams like Liverpool and Sheff Utd have a vision, trust the manager and go and do it. Klopp wants a specific player, they send scouts and go get him. Couple of big money signings, but a Robertson from relegated Hull, Wijnaldum from relegated Newcastle, Shaqiri from relegated Stoke and half of Southampton. Even Big Sam, as much as it is not pretty to watch, he knows what he needs and goes gets them.

We just get some players, Mr Oil and Mr Water and wonder why they dont mix. Haller has his faults, but to steal a quote from Mark Goldbridge, he is in a field with cows on laxatives, there is just piles of shit around him. 4 at the back. 5 at the back. No one can cross a ball. No one can pass. No one can run out of midfield with the ball. He cant be bothered to get into the box because a) he is not expecting a ball in there and b) if it does he is on his own with 2 CB's and keeper.

There is no coincidence that the only time we play well and look like winning is when Antonio is fit. Which explains exactly why we are 18th. Antonio is the key to getting the best out of Haller, whether by luck or judgment, that is a formula which has potential and Moyes has to make it work. Haller for his part needs to learn to move with Antonio. Another problem is he can't keep up (which is fine as not many can) but needs to be advanced enough, but not get caught offside all the time. Hopefully with Bowen or Anderson, we can have a front three who can press high up the field so we don't have to come from so far deep all the time so he doesn't need tons of pace. Rice / Soucek win the ball, get it to Antonio, maybe via a Fornals or Snodgrass, then have him run, then his partners need to be available each side to pick up the pieces and move into the spaces Antonio creates.
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Whiskyman
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by Whiskyman » Sat Feb 15, 2020 8:37 am

BCHammer wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 3:18 am
He is a good player.

But we dont have a vision, plan or anything. This stinks of someone in a boardroom securing the best striker in Europe available who is willing to come to West Ham, without anyone checking why he was successful at Frankfurt and what else we need here for him to be equally successful.

Teams like Liverpool and Sheff Utd have a vision, trust the manager and go and do it. Klopp wants a specific player, they send scouts and go get him. Couple of big money signings, but a Robertson from relegated Hull, Wijnaldum from relegated Newcastle, Shaqiri from relegated Stoke and half of Southampton. Even Big Sam, as much as it is not pretty to watch, he knows what he needs and goes gets them.

We just get some players, Mr Oil and Mr Water and wonder why they dont mix. Haller has his faults, but to steal a quote from Mark Goldbridge, he is in a field with cows on laxatives, there is just piles of shit around him. 4 at the back. 5 at the back. No one can cross a ball. No one can pass. No one can run out of midfield with the ball. He cant be bothered to get into the box because a) he is not expecting a ball in there and b) if it does he is on his own with 2 CB's and keeper.

There is no coincidence that the only time we play well and look like winning is when Antonio is fit. Which explains exactly why we are 18th. Antonio is the key to getting the best out of Haller, whether by luck or judgment, that is a formula which has potential and Moyes has to make it work. Haller for his part needs to learn to move with Antonio. Another problem is he can't keep up (which is fine as not many can) but needs to be advanced enough, but not get caught offside all the time. Hopefully with Bowen or Anderson, we can have a front three who can press high up the field so we don't have to come from so far deep all the time so he doesn't need tons of pace. Rice / Soucek win the ball, get it to Antonio, maybe via a Fornals or Snodgrass, then have him run, then his partners need to be available each side to pick up the pieces and move into the spaces Antonio creates.
goodpost:)

Problem is though mate that if avoiding the drop depends on Antonio we are well fucked. He's developing into another Andy Carroll. Simply can't keep fit.
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TRADITION--Just because we've always done it like this doesn't mean it's not incredibly SILLY

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BlackDiamond
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by BlackDiamond » Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:55 am

terrya1965 wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:29 pm
Shouldn't the O be an A in Wonky? ;)
Your the first person to crack the code - I gave you an up vote in recognition for the Hammers Chat - Alan Turing award
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terrya1965
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Re: How wonky is Sébastien Haller

Post by terrya1965 » Sat Feb 15, 2020 11:30 am

BlackDiamond wrote:
Sat Feb 15, 2020 9:55 am
terrya1965 wrote:
Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:29 pm
Shouldn't the O be an A in Wonky? ;)
Your the first person to crack the code - I gave you an up vote in recognition for the Hammers Chat - Alan Turing award
:lol: :lol:
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