Relegation is the only option

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palerider
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Relegation is the only option

Postby palerider » Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:22 am

In gardening, if you have rotten bits in a shrub you love, you cut it back to the crown and let it re-grow healthily. And sadly, that's what needs to happen at West Ham.

It may sound drastic but I fear it's come to that, and to be honest I've given up on our chances anyway. I was still reasonably confident until I witnessed Saturday's collapse. And forget the protests. As soon as the first goal went in with Burnley's first shot, it was game over. Forget the claims that we could have got back into it. I beg to differ. For some reason, they've stopped playing for Moyes in the same way they stopped playing for Bilic. I don't need to put my gardening gloves on to see that the club's rotten from top to bottom. There are players out there for us stealing a living.

C&H have a piece about fine lines. 4 points better off if not for Madley and Antonio. True. And say we got really lucky over the next 8 games and stayed up. A flukey goal here, a sending-off there. Maybe a dodgy penalty or two. Do we 'dust ourselves down' as they say, wipe our brows and say things will definitely be better next season ?

Do we fuck. It will be more of the same. Remember Gold said he'd be amazed if we finished 11th again after last season. You got that right you old fart.

Southampton next. A must win game if ever there was one. They've seen that and brought in a new manager. Not that I rate Hughes but I bet he gets a tune out of them on the 31st.

Moyes too is not without blame. Too cautious in some games and too cavalier in others. With Bilic-esque selections at times. But it's at the top that the buck really stops.

Sullivan's prepared to appoint a director of football is he ? Responsible for all transfers ?

Yeah right. Another stooge. The dwarf would drown if his ego could be liquified. It would be impossible for him not to stick his nose in.

It will be a long process I'm afraid. The owners are going nowhere just yet. I don't subscribe to the view that we'll do a Sunderland though. It's very difficult attracting decent talent to the north-east. Even Newcastle have problems these days. And the one thing I will say in Sullivan's favour is that he does pay good wages. It's the transfer fees he struggles with. Maybe wages are more tax deductible. I'm not an accountant. And he'll be far more comfortable with the lesser amounts quoted a league down. Also, despite us being a basket case right now, London is still an attraction. But there are plenty of good teams in the Championship, so an immediate return is highly unlikely.

But there is a bit of hope long-term. With the proper manager, some entertainment on the pitch would gradually get the fans back onside, even with the current owners. We like to see our team win. You leave with a better feeling if you've won 3-0 rather than lost by that score even if it's Barnsley not Burnley. And new owners, who wouldn't touch us with a barge-pole at present would be more inclined to have a punt on a bit of potential. We'll still have a large and hugely loyal fanbase. And there's been massive investment lately in the Championship too.

But the plan is, make Sugo feel unloved and unwanted at every opportunity. Spend nothing in the ground or in the shop. Support the team on the field, but up the ante in the media, as that's where it will be won. An egomaniac hates that.



Now. I've got a hydrangea that needs sorting.

Rant over.
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tassiehammer
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby tassiehammer » Thu Mar 15, 2018 6:38 am

I wouldn't want to be that hydrangea with the mood you're in. :i am genuinely amused:
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eskimo joe
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby eskimo joe » Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:11 am

Good post Pale. Yes Sullivan pays good wages but only if he comes out 50p better off than any other option.

Some say that the pitch invasion had no affect but I beg to differ. It certainly made the media pay closer attention. Now is the time to forget that and channel efforts elsewhere. Protests yes, but those that have previously been suggested, static ones before and after each home game. Make them feel unwanted, make them feel as shitty after a game as they have made you pay to feel.
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Porterman
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby Porterman » Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:31 am

Good post mate but " my fear" is that it may go " the Sunderland way" rather than your vision!!

What CANNOT be argued about is your assessment and it's one of the few RATIONAL posts on here that looks at THE PLAYERS as well as everything else.

Like yourself I made a rare venture to the game on Saturday and was ABSOLUTELY STUNNED by what I saw from some in our colours.

I can honestly say I have NEVER witnessed a poorer less interested or less passionate display from a so called professional footballer ( at any club) than I witnessed from Kouyate on Saturday.

The man was an absolute FUCKING DISGRACE.

Hes now been an absolute disgrace under Allardyce, Bilic AND Moyes so to blame any ONE of these managers ( no matter if you like them or not) is WRONG.

It's not just us.

They are doing it at Stoke.

They are doing it at Soton.

They are doing it at WBA.

They were doing it at Swansea but for some reason have now turned up!!

There is absolutely NO DIFFERENCE whatsoever regarding any of the above squads and Burnleys yet look at the differences!!

I'm afraid " shit attitudes" only lead to one thing ( as Sunderland have found out to their cost) and having that in The Championship will only result in more of the same!!
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Baddowhammer
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby Baddowhammer » Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:47 am

goodpost:) goodpost:)
palerider wrote:In gardening, if you have rotten bits in a shrub you love, you cut it back to the crown and let it re-grow healthily. And sadly, that's what needs to happen at West Ham.

It may sound drastic but I fear it's come to that, and to be honest I've given up on our chances anyway. I was still reasonably confident until I witnessed Saturday's collapse. And forget the protests. As soon as the first goal went in with Burnley's first shot, it was game over. Forget the claims that we could have got back into it. I beg to differ. For some reason, they've stopped playing for Moyes in the same way they stopped playing for Bilic. I don't need to put my gardening gloves on to see that the club's rotten from top to bottom. There are players out there for us stealing a living.

C&H have a piece about fine lines. 4 points better off if not for Madley and Antonio. True. And say we got really lucky over the next 8 games and stayed up. A flukey goal here, a sending-off there. Maybe a dodgy penalty or two. Do we 'dust ourselves down' as they say, wipe our brows and say things will definitely be better next season ?

Do we fuck. It will be more of the same. Remember Gold said he'd be amazed if we finished 11th again after last season. You got that right you old fart.

Southampton next. A must win game if ever there was one. They've seen that and brought in a new manager. Not that I rate Hughes but I bet he gets a tune out of them on the 31st.

Moyes too is not without blame. Too cautious in some games and too cavalier in others. With Bilic-esque selections at times. But it's at the top that the buck really stops.

Sullivan's prepared to appoint a director of football is he ? Responsible for all transfers ?

Yeah right. Another stooge. The dwarf would drown if his ego could be liquified. It would be impossible for him not to stick his nose in.

It will be a long process I'm afraid. The owners are going nowhere just yet. I don't subscribe to the view that we'll do a Sunderland though. It's very difficult attracting decent talent to the north-east. Even Newcastle have problems these days. And the one thing I will say in Sullivan's favour is that he does pay good wages. It's the transfer fees he struggles with. Maybe wages are more tax deductible. I'm not an accountant. And he'll be far more comfortable with the lesser amounts quoted a league down. Also, despite us being a basket case right now, London is still an attraction. But there are plenty of good teams in the Championship, so an immediate return is highly unlikely.

But there is a bit of hope long-term. With the proper manager, some entertainment on the pitch would gradually get the fans back onside, even with the current owners. We like to see our team win. You leave with a better feeling if you've won 3-0 rather than lost by that score even if it's Barnsley not Burnley. And new owners, who wouldn't touch us with a barge-pole at present would be more inclined to have a punt on a bit of potential. We'll still have a large and hugely loyal fanbase. And there's been massive investment lately in the Championship too.

But the plan is, make Sugo feel unloved and unwanted at every opportunity. Spend nothing in the ground or in the shop. Support the team on the field, but up the ante in the media, as that's where it will be won. An egomaniac hates that.



Now. I've got a hydrangea that needs sorting.

Rant over.
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palerider
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby palerider » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:07 am

Porterman wrote:Good post mate but " my fear" is that it may go " the Sunderland way" rather than your vision!!

What CANNOT be argued about is your assessment and it's one of the few RATIONAL posts on here that looks at THE PLAYERS as well as everything else.

Like yourself I made a rare venture to the game on Saturday and was ABSOLUTELY STUNNED by what I saw from some in our colours.

I can honestly say I have NEVER witnessed a poorer less interested or less passionate display from a so called professional footballer ( at any club) than I witnessed from Kouyate on Saturday.

The man was an absolute FUCKING DISGRACE.

Hes now been an absolute disgrace under Allardyce, Bilic AND Moyes so to blame any ONE of these managers ( no matter if you like them or not) is WRONG.

It's not just us.

They are doing it at Stoke.

They are doing it at Soton.

They are doing it at WBA.

They were doing it at Swansea but for some reason have now turned up!!

There is absolutely NO DIFFERENCE whatsoever regarding any of the above squads and Burnleys yet look at the differences!!

I'm afraid " shit attitudes" only lead to one thing ( as Sunderland have found out to their cost) and having that in The Championship will only result in more of the same!!

I don't think we'll do a Sunderland Porter for the reasons I've stated, but hope is at hand, never fear.

Talk about wearing a 'retro' shirt for the Southampton match to unite everyone.

That will make all the difference, I see it now.


:i am genuinely amused: :i am genuinely amused:
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eskimo joe
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby eskimo joe » Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:41 am

The " who gives a fuck " attitude has seeped down from the top. And you can use the old chestnut to say the players are professional and paid well so should perform regardless just as easy as you could use the lead by example. But like you and I, they are also human, better paid, but human none the less. Can anyone honestly say that under these and their OM they wouldn't begin to feel the same way.

The real decline started at the beginning of Payets second season, that's when Sullivans hidden colours really started to seep through his façade. The move and the crap that went with it added to it all.

I don't for one minute like what has been happening on the pitch but the in club atmosphere is shyte and it rubs off despite what some may think.
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Whiskyman
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby Whiskyman » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:24 am

palerider wrote:It will be a long process I'm afraid. The owners are going nowhere just yet. I don't subscribe to the view that we'll do a Sunderland though. It's very difficult attracting decent talent to the north-east. Even Newcastle have problems these days. And the one thing I will say in Sullivan's favour is that he does pay good wages.


Not sure that's always a good thing tbh mate. If a player is choosing a club purely on the basis of salary it says something about their mindset imo. It even applies to young players, not even established as first team players. Take Reece Oxford as an example. Apparently when he signed his last contract he was wanted by, among others, Manchester United. So why did he decide to stay at West Ham? And more to the point has he maybe stopped working at improving his game because he is in a financial comfort zone.?
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Porterman
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby Porterman » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:48 am

Whiskyman wrote:
palerider wrote:It will be a long process I'm afraid. The owners are going nowhere just yet. I don't subscribe to the view that we'll do a Sunderland though. It's very difficult attracting decent talent to the north-east. Even Newcastle have problems these days. And the one thing I will say in Sullivan's favour is that he does pay good wages.


Not sure that's always a good thing tbh mate. If a player is choosing a club purely on the basis of salary it says something about their mindset imo. It even applies to young players, not even established as first team players. Take Reece Oxford as an example. Apparently when he signed his last contract he was wanted by, among others, Manchester United. So why did he decide to stay at West Ham? And more to the point has he maybe stopped working at improving his game because he is in a financial comfort zone.?


Think you almost "bang on the mark".

Oxford (though only one) is a good example of "ive got the cash and thats all that matters"...or so it seems!!

Its an EPIDEMIC in the game.

Players WHO HAVE NEVER influenced one game in any meaningful way leaving the game with untold wealth.

As a club what can you "realistically" do?!

Its becoming " a massive gamble" now when you sign ANY player what you will get.

In most case its north of "sweet fuck all"!!

Watching the game on Saturday I watched that Joao Mario (it wasnt hard he hardly moved anywhere)"!!

What is that (he) all about?!

No effort,no desire.....no nothing!!

You can of course say "oh hes come into the team/club at a bad time.

Really?

When we are club paying is it the 7th highest wages in The Prem ?!!

If thats the case....."when would be a good time"?!!!

We have had the Allardyce debate,the Bilic debate and now the Moyes debate.

Dont know about you but when you talk about a player being gash under all 3 I know what I look for as "the common denominator"!!!!!

As for "the who gives a fuck" attitute seeping down from the top are you honestly telling me the aquisition of Englands No 1 keeper, a fully commited and experienced (though admittedly ageing) world class full back , a recent Euro Champ winning defender (who marshalled his defence to being the 2nd tightest in the league in recent times), adding ANOTHER Euro winning player, spending £20 odd mill on a player that looked very good at Swansea (IMO), adding a £22m forward (a very good one at that whilst the aforementioned wages structure equates to " couldnt give a fuck"?!

And that before you add into the mix things like Noble and Collins who as fans we think "would die for the club"!!
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h69
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Re: Relegation is the only option

Postby h69 » Thu Mar 15, 2018 11:49 am

Whiskyman wrote:
palerider wrote:It will be a long process I'm afraid. The owners are going nowhere just yet. I don't subscribe to the view that we'll do a Sunderland though. It's very difficult attracting decent talent to the north-east. Even Newcastle have problems these days. And the one thing I will say in Sullivan's favour is that he does pay good wages.


Not sure that's always a good thing tbh mate. If a player is choosing a club purely on the basis of salary it says something about their mindset imo. It even applies to young players, not even established as first team players. Take Reece Oxford as an example. Apparently when he signed his last contract he was wanted by, among others, Manchester United. So why did he decide to stay at West Ham? And more to the point has he maybe stopped working at improving his game because he is in a financial comfort zone.?


Yes.....and to an extent that is what is going horribly wrong at Chelsea. Diego Costa a perfect example of it.
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