Tommy Robinson

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h69
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by h69 » Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:15 am

whu wrote:
h69 wrote:
I havent judged them all Dave, I am sure many are there making their point correctly and fairly and so fair play to them but I personally would not want to be seen supporting an organisation with members openly displaying Nazi salutes despite agreeing with some of the points they are trying to make. I'd feel the same if I saw West Ham fans going round doing it also.

As for all muslims being terrorists or child molesters, only a moron would actually believe that.

Lets be honest though, marching achieves the square root of fuck all anyway so the whole protest has achieved nothing positive.
yeah, a march never changed on single thing in life, ever

i couldn't disagree more

why do people do it then? from the suffragettes to poll tax - you actually think every march has never changed anything whatsoever?

i'm sure you're just fishing but that's actually quite a naïve point

15-20,000 in Whitehall on any subject, will be firmly noted by the powers that be

probably the same as one in five voting ukip had zero impact on tory immigration policy?

what's your answer in a democracy then? vote, wait 4-5 years, vote again, the end?

heard this a thousand times, the old NIMBY - then people start lobbying their mp and arranging protest - to be seen to try to make change
Like I said on the football March thread, the last march that actually had some effect was the Suffragettes.....even the poll tax riots only succeeded in getting the poll tax changed to a different name.

If you think that a few people marching up and down Whitehall made a difference last week then fair play to you but you seem to think that the govt didn't know anything about this before and so the march made the views of them 'firmly noted'
However, I saw a graphic the other day of the priorities for all the govts around the western world ranked and 1 and 2 were Terrorism and Immigration in almost every country including ours so I ask again, what has this march achieved ?

Protests only happen because people feel helpless but it wont change. You mention the Tory immigration policy, but what is that exactly .. has it even changed, they always have targets that are lower than what they achieve and always will.

However, I will wait and see what a couple of thousand people manage to achieve in the next year. This march was banging on about 'free Tommy Robinson' but he broke the law and so lets see whether the law is changed because of this march.
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FlatCapDave
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by FlatCapDave » Fri Jun 15, 2018 11:19 am

Regardless of the cause, any time we see people on the streets marching for something they believe in it has to be considered a good thing.

Apathy is far more unsettling than anything else, and would signal that we've really reached rock bottom.
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by Oziron » Fri Jun 15, 2018 1:15 pm

FlatCapDave wrote:
Oziron wrote: Good point and i don't believe for one minute that all in the EDL are racist. We have very similar 'patriot' movement in Oz and they are also proud to wheel out a few 'ethnics' to show that they are not a racist group but when you scratch the surface it usually reveals something a little different.
Those fellas aren't to be fucked with, and they're not going to allow themselves or their heritage to be manipulated so some secret white nationalists can play their agenda.
I'm glad to hear that Dave.....
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by Neville Bartos » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:05 pm

FlatCapDave wrote:
Oziron wrote: Good point and i don't believe for one minute that all in the EDL are racist. We have very similar 'patriot' movement in Oz and they are also proud to wheel out a few 'ethnics' to show that they are not a racist group but when you scratch the surface it usually reveals something a little different.
I think you may be a bit out of touch with how things work here mate, ain't no one "wheeling out" Sikhs for any agenda. Those fellas aren't to be fucked with, and they're not going to allow themselves or their heritage to be manipulated so some secret white nationalists can play their agenda.
I don't think OZ is too far off the mark. Like it or not groups like the EDL tend to attract people with far right views. That seems to be because they're often founded by people with far right views.
A couple of Sikhs in the EDL and the odd black geezer, or Asian in the BNP doesn't mean that culturally or racially intolerant people are the exception in those organisations. Far from it.
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by whu » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:29 pm

Neville Bartos wrote:
FlatCapDave wrote:
I think you may be a bit out of touch with how things work here mate, ain't no one "wheeling out" Sikhs for any agenda. Those fellas aren't to be fucked with, and they're not going to allow themselves or their heritage to be manipulated so some secret white nationalists can play their agenda.
I don't think OZ is too far off the mark. Like it or not groups like the EDL tend to attract people with far right views. That seems to be because they're often founded by people with far right views.
A couple of Sikhs in the EDL and the odd black geezer, or Asian in the BNP doesn't mean that culturally or racially intolerant people are the exception in those organisations. Far from it.
fuck off you abbott wanking commie gimp ;) :lol: whufc_crest

have a good one nev, weekend that is ...
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whu
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by whu » Fri Jun 15, 2018 8:33 pm

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... nald-trump" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

this shit stirring commie rag put it at 15,000 chaps so trust me, it really wasn't far off 20,000

they would never exaggerate a turn out from any right of centre gig, on that we can all agree

brown out - in a west ham way
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by Neville Bartos » Fri Jun 15, 2018 9:19 pm

whu wrote:
Neville Bartos wrote:
I don't think OZ is too far off the mark. Like it or not groups like the EDL tend to attract people with far right views. That seems to be because they're often founded by people with far right views.
A couple of Sikhs in the EDL and the odd black geezer, or Asian in the BNP doesn't mean that culturally or racially intolerant people are the exception in those organisations. Far from it.
fuck off you abbott wanking commie gimp ;) :i am genuinely amused: whufc_crest

have a good one nev, weekend that is ...
I will admit I've never been fussy when it comes to the fairer sex. :D

You have a good one too, mate. ;)
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by mkhammer » Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:50 am

Being able to march freely is the sign of a free country,and we should be proud and happy that
we live in a country that allows it,and not take it for granted......

Personally don't do them......even if at sometimes I agree with the cause,because they attract
Agitators, Extremists, and Anarchists.....however well meaning and well organised they are...

Unfortunately there's always people that want a confrontation,stir things up,and have
ulterior motives.....and they jump on the bandwagon....and fuck it up for everyone else..
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by FlatCapDave » Sat Jun 16, 2018 7:00 pm

Neville Bartos wrote: I don't think OZ is too far off the mark. Like it or not groups like the EDL tend to attract people with far right views. That seems to be because they're often founded by people with far right views.

A couple of Sikhs in the EDL and the odd black geezer, or Asian in the BNP doesn't mean that culturally or racially intolerant people are the exception in those organisations. Far from it.
My objection was that he posted an image of what looked like torch-carrying US far-right white nationalists, comparing them with the EDL, which I think is way wide of the mark.

A group of white nationalists aren't going to accept anyone who isn't white, token or not, within their ranks. It goes against what they stand for. The aims of those types of people are pretty different to the aims of British nationalists I'd reckon.

The likes of the EDL have an issue with militant Islam, not people of colour. There's a big difference there.

The relationship between certain factions of the Sikh and Muslim communities isn't always the best, and the history of that is well documented.

And let's be honest, anyone who's familiar with the Sikh community in the UK should know fine well that they're not the types to be mugged off into playing "the token minority" in a white nationalist game. They're involved with the EDL because they stand behind the message against militant Islam, and God knows they know a fair bit about that.
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Re: Tommy Robinson

Post by Neville Bartos » Sat Jun 16, 2018 8:26 pm

FlatCapDave wrote:
Neville Bartos wrote: I don't think OZ is too far off the mark. Like it or not groups like the EDL tend to attract people with far right views. That seems to be because they're often founded by people with far right views.

A couple of Sikhs in the EDL and the odd black geezer, or Asian in the BNP doesn't mean that culturally or racially intolerant people are the exception in those organisations. Far from it.
My objection was that he posted an image of what looked like torch-carrying US far-right white nationalists, comparing them with the EDL, which I think is way wide of the mark.

A group of white nationalists aren't going to accept anyone who isn't white, token or not, within their ranks. It goes against what they stand for. The aims of those types of people are pretty different to the aims of British nationalists I'd reckon.

The likes of the EDL have an issue with militant Islam, not people of colour. There's a big difference there.

The relationship between certain factions of the Sikh and Muslim communities isn't always the best, and the history of that is well documented.

And let's be honest, anyone who's familiar with the Sikh community in the UK should know fine well that they're not the types to be mugged off into playing "the token minority" in a white nationalist game. They're involved with the EDL because they stand behind the message against militant Islam, and God knows they know a fair bit about that.
Yeah, the US is a different kettle of fish. The Democrats are slightly right of the Tories and they get called socialists. Which in my book skews everything.

I'm not entirely convinced Robinson or the EDL can be taken at face value.
Robinson has stated he left the BNP -- after a year -- because he didn't know Nick Griffin had been in the National Front, and that the BNP didn't accept non-whites. Which, if you think about it, is laughable.
And Robinson himself left the EDL because, and I quote 'it's ranks had become swollen with racist and neo-nazi supporters'.

All religions seem to have a problem with each other, I'll not argue that point at all. Religion is the driving force behind plenty of ongoing conflicts around the planet. And even when people share the same religion they still want to fight.

I'm pretty certain most reasonable people are against militant Islam. And since when have marches, riots and confrontation been anything but divisive? I don't think anything the EDL does helps with things like radicalisation, isolation, or sends any kind of message that isn't divisive.

I'll ask you what you think is the answer to radicalisation and militant Islam is?
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