WHU as a Business

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frogiron3
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WHU as a Business

Post by frogiron3 »

Morning -

I don't get approaching football as if I were a contestant on The Apprentice.

Maybe the owners encourage it. By discussing annual results, financial forecasts, “involving” us in the “business” then fans will excuse their appalling decisions as financial sense. Or worse, feel like they have been part of them.

As if anything any of us said or thought would make the slightest difference to a multi-million pound entertainment business. Owned by an individual. We’re not Union Berlin. We are a club owned by very wealthy people who act in their own self-interest.

The idea of involvement is, imo, a smoke screen

I grew up with Greenwood and Lyall. Those were salad days. Ricocheting between success and failure, winning cups and relegation. Always dramatic, always engaging. Always playing the “right” way. It may have helped as a kid being four feet from the playing surface - so close you could smell the deep heat on the players and hear every word they said. But it was magical and emotional.

Look at what we’ve had to endure since those days.

We had Bilic – exciting but too mercurial. Roeder – one of my most disengaged periods. I think I slept through most of it. Zola – f**k it, lets see what happens. Oh - that. Curbs – Let’s make us as safe and boring as Charlton. Allardyce was the most hideous, anti-football, arrogant dick. I screamed like a banshee when his name was being proposed. And I hated every single minute of his tenure. My worst period in my 55 years as a west ham fan.

I loved our time under Arry. He made things exciting – you never knew what was going to happen. He was like betting blind – you could end up with a royal flush, or a nine high. Ludicrously unpredictable. But it was fun.

And that is what I want. Fun.

If it is just about success, we’re following the wrong club. It’s always been about entertainment. Otherwise why support West Ham?

If it’s about business, I simply don’t care. It's not my money.

Rich people who buy football cubs don’t do it for sound financial motives. It’s a vanity thing. Which is fine – fill your boots. Strut around in a Russian hat all you like. But don’t expect me to give the tiniest of sh*ts about your financial well-being. It’s your business. You chose to buy it. Freely chose. And you enjoy the cachet of sitting in the Directors box. Good for you – you paid for it.

I can buy potatoes at Tesco. I can like their potatoes. It does not mean I need to be involved in, care about, or even think about, the annual results of supermarket. I Don’t care.

The job of an owner is to dig deep, spend money and entertain me. If you can’t afford it, sling your hook and sell to someone who can. That’s the entertainment business.

I follow the club for excitement. For drama. I’d rather flirt with relegation than sit watching a bunch of static lumps grind out a 0-0 by being “hard to beat”.

Just give me entertainment again. I just hate the “mid-table security” mindset. More Arry. Less Fat Sam.

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OZHAMMER
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by OZHAMMER »

The Arry era was the most enjoyable for me.

The Big Sam era was the worst.

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palerider
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by palerider »

frogiron3 wrote: Thu May 02, 2024 10:54 am Morning -

I don't get approaching football as if I were a contestant on The Apprentice.

Maybe the owners encourage it. By discussing annual results, financial forecasts, “involving” us in the “business” then fans will excuse their appalling decisions as financial sense. Or worse, feel like they have been part of them.

As if anything any of us said or thought would make the slightest difference to a multi-million pound entertainment business. Owned by an individual. We’re not Union Berlin. We are a club owned by very wealthy people who act in their own self-interest.

The idea of involvement is, imo, a smoke screen

I grew up with Greenwood and Lyall. Those were salad days. Ricocheting between success and failure, winning cups and relegation. Always dramatic, always engaging. Always playing the “right” way. It may have helped as a kid being four feet from the playing surface - so close you could smell the deep heat on the players and hear every word they said. But it was magical and emotional.

Look at what we’ve had to endure since those days.

We had Bilic – exciting but too mercurial. Roeder – one of my most disengaged periods. I think I slept through most of it. Zola – f**k it, lets see what happens. Oh - that. Curbs – Let’s make us as safe and boring as Charlton. Allardyce was the most hideous, anti-football, arrogant dick. I screamed like a banshee when his name was being proposed. And I hated every single minute of his tenure. My worst period in my 55 years as a west ham fan.

I loved our time under Arry. He made things exciting – you never knew what was going to happen. He was like betting blind – you could end up with a royal flush, or a nine high. Ludicrously unpredictable. But it was fun.

And that is what I want. Fun.

If it is just about success, we’re following the wrong club. It’s always been about entertainment. Otherwise why support West Ham?

If it’s about business, I simply don’t care. It's not my money.

Rich people who buy football cubs don’t do it for sound financial motives. It’s a vanity thing. Which is fine – fill your boots. Strut around in a Russian hat all you like. But don’t expect me to give the tiniest of sh*ts about your financial well-being. It’s your business. You chose to buy it. Freely chose. And you enjoy the cachet of sitting in the Directors box. Good for you – you paid for it.

I can buy potatoes at Tesco. I can like their potatoes. It does not mean I need to be involved in, care about, or even think about, the annual results of supermarket. I Don’t care.

The job of an owner is to dig deep, spend money and entertain me. If you can’t afford it, sling your hook and sell to someone who can. That’s the entertainment business.

I follow the club for excitement. For drama. I’d rather flirt with relegation than sit watching a bunch of static lumps grind out a 0-0 by being “hard to beat”.

Just give me entertainment again. I just hate the “mid-table security” mindset. More Arry. Less Fat Sam.
Fine words Frog. I've been driven to tears. I may have to brave the rain and vote loony in the local election to calm me down.

Fwiw I enjoyed the Harry era the best too.



What happened to frogiron2 btw ?

Is he that brother you don't mention and keeped locked up in the cellar ?

frogiron3
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by frogiron3 »

Hello mate -
Frogiron 2 forgot his password. Entered the wrong one a few times. Then got a message saying I as not allowed any more tries until I did a Captcha test. Problem is, there was no Captcha test to take. So emailed Admin. Waited a couple of weeks. Got bored waiting. Signed up again with a different email address :lol: :lol:

Dear Arry. You wouldn't trust him as your bank manager. Or even Rosie his dog. But bloody hell it was entertaining. The era of DiCanio was probably my favourite period as a fan. I adored that mental case :lol:

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palerider
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by palerider »

frogiron3 wrote: Thu May 02, 2024 11:31 am Hello mate -
Frogiron 2 forgot his password. Entered the wrong one a few times. Then got a message saying I as not allowed any more tries until I did a Captcha test. Problem is, there was no Captcha test to take. So emailed Admin. Waited a couple of weeks. Got bored waiting. Signed up again with a different email address :lol: :lol:

Dear Arry. You wouldn't trust him as your bank manager. Or even Rosie his dog. But bloody hell it was entertaining. The era of DiCanio was probably my favourite period as a fan. I adored that mental case :lol:
I've mentioned this before. Imagine Harry and PDC as our management team.

Boring it most certainly would not be.

I'd renew in a heartbeat.

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Whiskyman
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by Whiskyman »

Good to see you back on the forum Monsieur. Just a few observations.

"The job of an owner is to dig deep, spend money and entertain me".. Not allowed. FFP and various other artificially imposed restrictions to ensure the continuation of the status quo have prevented the emergence of another Abramovich type. Just ask Amanda Staveley up there in Geordieland if you don't believe me, she'll put you right.

"If it is just about success, we’re following the wrong club. It’s always been about entertainment. Otherwise why support West Ham?". We all have different reasons for supporting the club. Mine is accident of birth, having lived in Forest Gate until the family moved out to the sticks when I was 14. So it's the "right" club for me but surely there's nothing wrong with wanting to see the club at least make an effort to compete. And I don't mean on a match to match basis but to compete as a meaningful club and not just be content to be part of the rump that are only there to make up the fixture list.

Not sure that it's always been about entertainment either tbh. I'm sure over the years I've watched more crap teams than good ones. For me nothing will, unfortunately, ever come close to 1985/86. Now that lot was a fucking team to die for. The promotion season of 80/81 was a blast as well despite half our defeats that season being against Luton. But much of the time we've had to endure crap teams, occasionally enlivened by mercurial talents like diCanio and Payet. I guess it was the same back in the 60s when we had 3 world cup winners on the books but were constantly pretty crap in the league. How useless must the rest of them have been ?

I don't go any more, haven't done since the pornmeister bought the gaff, but I'm still hooked enough to watch every kick on the box, thanks to the internet. But I guess I don't have as much right to moan as the hardy souls who still fork out their hard earned to attend in person. Which maybe why I do put results ahead of entertainment, and I'd venture to suggest most fans, and by that I mean the real fans who travel all over the country watching the team, not the couch potatos like I am today, would agree. But imo there's no reason why a team shouldn't have a bit of flair and imagination as well as a strong backbone. Aston Villa are a club a bit like us in many respects and we've all seen what a difference a decent coach can make to a side that struggled big time under Smith and Gerrard before Unai Emery shipped up.

And finally I hope you noticed that your hometown boys gave a good account of themselves back in League One this year. Bon chance.
Why Is There Only One Monopolies Commission. Isn't That A Monopoly?

frogiron3
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by frogiron3 »

Hahaha - it would not old pal. A dream team! What a rollercoaster. You wouldn't take your eyes off the game for a minute.

:lol: :lol: :lol:



palerider wrote: Thu May 02, 2024 11:58 am
frogiron3 wrote: Thu May 02, 2024 11:31 am Hello mate -
Frogiron 2 forgot his password. Entered the wrong one a few times. Then got a message saying I as not allowed any more tries until I did a Captcha test. Problem is, there was no Captcha test to take. So emailed Admin. Waited a couple of weeks. Got bored waiting. Signed up again with a different email address :lol: :lol:

Dear Arry. You wouldn't trust him as your bank manager. Or even Rosie his dog. But bloody hell it was entertaining. The era of DiCanio was probably my favourite period as a fan. I adored that mental case :lol:
I've mentioned this before. Imagine Harry and PDC as our management team.

Boring it most certainly would not be.

I'd renew in a heartbeat.

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Fade-and-Die
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by Fade-and-Die »

frogiron3 wrote: Thu May 02, 2024 10:54 am Morning -

I don't get approaching football as if I were a contestant on The Apprentice.

Maybe the owners encourage it. By discussing annual results, financial forecasts, “involving” us in the “business” then fans will excuse their appalling decisions as financial sense. Or worse, feel like they have been part of them.

As if anything any of us said or thought would make the slightest difference to a multi-million pound entertainment business. Owned by an individual. We’re not Union Berlin. We are a club owned by very wealthy people who act in their own self-interest.

The idea of involvement is, imo, a smoke screen

I grew up with Greenwood and Lyall. Those were salad days. Ricocheting between success and failure, winning cups and relegation. Always dramatic, always engaging. Always playing the “right” way. It may have helped as a kid being four feet from the playing surface - so close you could smell the deep heat on the players and hear every word they said. But it was magical and emotional.

Look at what we’ve had to endure since those days.

We had Bilic – exciting but too mercurial. Roeder – one of my most disengaged periods. I think I slept through most of it. Zola – f**k it, lets see what happens. Oh - that. Curbs – Let’s make us as safe and boring as Charlton. Allardyce was the most hideous, anti-football, arrogant dick. I screamed like a banshee when his name was being proposed. And I hated every single minute of his tenure. My worst period in my 55 years as a west ham fan.

I loved our time under Arry. He made things exciting – you never knew what was going to happen. He was like betting blind – you could end up with a royal flush, or a nine high. Ludicrously unpredictable. But it was fun.

And that is what I want. Fun.

If it is just about success, we’re following the wrong club. It’s always been about entertainment. Otherwise why support West Ham?

If it’s about business, I simply don’t care. It's not my money.

Rich people who buy football cubs don’t do it for sound financial motives. It’s a vanity thing. Which is fine – fill your boots. Strut around in a Russian hat all you like. But don’t expect me to give the tiniest of sh*ts about your financial well-being. It’s your business. You chose to buy it. Freely chose. And you enjoy the cachet of sitting in the Directors box. Good for you – you paid for it.

I can buy potatoes at Tesco. I can like their potatoes. It does not mean I need to be involved in, care about, or even think about, the annual results of supermarket. I Don’t care.

The job of an owner is to dig deep, spend money and entertain me. If you can’t afford it, sling your hook and sell to someone who can. That’s the entertainment business.

I follow the club for excitement. For drama. I’d rather flirt with relegation than sit watching a bunch of static lumps grind out a 0-0 by being “hard to beat”.

Just give me entertainment again. I just hate the “mid-table security” mindset. More Arry. Less Fat Sam.
My thoughts exactly, line by line, point by point.

And welcome back, mate. Again :D

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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by eastcoastclaret »

The frogs back and making sense as always.
Anyone seen Nev?
gonna need a bigger boat...my thumbs have gone weird...weleese bwian...I didn't eat the salmon mousse...nice beaver...like a glove...I have nipples Greg...the details of my life...he's not the messiah....

frogiron3
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Re: WHU as a Business

Post by frogiron3 »

Whiskyman wrote: Thu May 02, 2024 12:42 pm Good to see you back on the forum Monsieur. Just a few observations.

Hello Whisky. Nice to see you again. Hope all is good with you.

"The job of an owner is to dig deep, spend money and entertain me".. Not allowed. FFP and various other artificially imposed restrictions to ensure the continuation of the status quo have prevented the emergence of another Abramovich type. Just ask Amanda Staveley up there in Geordieland if you don't believe me, she'll put you right".

Isn't it fundamentally about the relationship between income and expenditure? Man City seem to have reasonable coffers to delve into. I understand a proprtion of this is (allegedly) due to the invention of sponsorship deals, giving more (albeit fictitious) income, and thereby allowing more expenditure? Although to PL seem a little nervyy about persuing this too vigourously - if they did they wouldn't get all those lovely petro-dollars washing in and the free jollies in Dubai. My point is simply that I couldn't give a tinker's cuss about the finances of my club's owner. Just entertain me. If that leads to a Brighton or a Southampton rather than competing with a moneybags oil state owner, I don't care. One little bit.


"If it is just about success, we’re following the wrong club. It’s always been about entertainment. Otherwise why support West Ham?". We all have different reasons for supporting the club. Mine is accident of birth, having lived in Forest Gate until the family moved out to the sticks when I was 14. So it's the "right" club for me but surely there's nothing wrong with wanting to see the club at least make an effort to compete. And I don't mean on a match to match basis but to compete as a meaningful club and not just be content to be part of the rump that are only there to make up the fixture list.


Mate, I am a Stevenage boy. I wasn't born within the sound of Bow Bells. I was born and grew up on an estate within the sound of windows being stoved in at the neighbourhood shops. I latched on to WHU because of their reputation of doing things the "right" way. Of being “classy” (because I am a really classy guy :lol: ) I couldn’t care less about success, unlike my Man U / Chelsea / Arsenal supporting peers at the time. I could always rest smug in the knowledge that we played the beautiful game. We rose above. If that meant losing to Tranmere or Stoke in an ignominious cup defeat, so be it.

Not sure that it's always been about entertainment either tbh. I'm sure over the years I've watched more crap teams than good ones. For me nothing will, unfortunately, ever come close to 1985/86. Now that lot was a fucking team to die for. The promotion season of 80/81 was a blast as well despite half our defeats that season being against Luton. But much of the time we've had to endure crap teams, occasionally enlivened by mercurial talents like diCanio and Payet. I guess it was the same back in the 60s when we had 3 world cup winners on the books but were constantly pretty crap in the league. How useless must the rest of them have been ?

Entertainment comes in many forms. Some get their kicks by knowing they won’t be relegated. Hell for me is starting the season with a “Oh well – mid table it is again then. Won’t be exciting but we won’t get relegated” F**k that for a game of soldiers.
You mention Villa. A purple patch now. But hardly a history peppered with regular success? And Emery - a coach I do rate highly – could not make Arsenal work. Yet Arteta strolls in and they are pulling up trees.
What I’m saying is that success, or the lack of it, goes with the territory. Unless you are City with limitless resources, fans, I believe, accept they don’t have a right to win (unless you are a Spurs fan). What I believe is more valuable is how you play. And the tingle in the spine that comes from knowing it could be amazing. Awe inspiring. Or a bag of shite. That’s all I’m trying to say.

More Red Star Paris, less PSG.

And finally I hope you noticed that your hometown boys gave a good account of themselves back in League One this year. Bon chance.


Yes, the lads from my “ends” as my sons inform me is the vernacular now, are doing really well. Last time I saw them, they had a stand along one side of the pitch, and railings round the other three! I actually saw Stanley Matthews play there for Port Vale against Stevenage. I am not, a you may have gathered, a regular attendee :lol: :lol:

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